Peter Slipper Resigns As Speaker

Federal Parliament Speaker Peter Slipper has stepped aside while investigations are underway into allegations of sexual harassment and fraud against him.

So... what now? 

Comments

[Andy Semple]

1.

Wilkie becomes a "player" again.

[ThePhilosopher]

2.

Tony Windsor will put his hand up no doubt. Delusions of grandeur rule with all these independants.

Their reign will soon end.

Actualy its just more to show that Juliar is in big trouble. Haveing backed him in as Speaker if any guilt is established it will reflect poorly on her any way that you look at it.

Slipper the HSU, carbon Tax is all slowly adding to the pile of mismanagent and outright lies that will ultimately break this camels back.

The Parliament of Australia is an international laughing stock and if Juliar cared more about Australia than she does about personal ambitin she would go to GG Bryce for and election first thing Monday morning.

Time for a long overdue house cleaning.

[kraka]

3.

I don't think that will be a good thing. None of the alledged independents are going to swallow their pride and admit that this government is incompetent and do not deserve their support. The irony in Windsor's case is he could probably get re-elected if he changed his mind. The left love cutting off their nose to spite their face-it's in their DNA

[ThePhilosopher]

4.

Kraka it will not be good for ongoing government.

The independants know that they are politicaly dead and that this is their last gasp. Hang onto the perks for as long as possible and to hell with the country is now the Mantra of the left and the indies.

[budgie smuggler]

5.

Perhaps......he's innocent.

[ThePhilosopher]

6.

Dear canary Penis perhis he is..No one has said that he isn't. I take it your poor comprehension and reading abaility results from a public education ?

[ThePhilosopher]

7.

You will note this qualification in my post "if any guilt is established it will reflect poorly on her "

Andy just posts an article of Slippers standing aside during an investigation and Kraka and I are dealing with the hypertheticals raised in this thread which is its whole intent and not his guilt or innocense which is yet to be established. If you cant get your head around that shove a dead seagull down your jocks

[budgie smuggler]

8.

"I take it your poor comprehension and reading abaility[sic] results from a public education ?"
"..Kraka and I are dealing with the hypertheticals [sic] raised .."
".. his guilt or innocense [sic] which is yet to.."
".. with all these independants.[sic]"
"..personal ambitin [sic]"
Want more?
Where exactly did YOU go to school philosopher?

[jon]

9.

So who gets the job now? Are they going to give it back to Harry Jenkins? Ah but that's right, he quit because he wanted to "participate in policy and debate". Wonder how that's working out for him.

[Mr T]

10.

Ahh budgie smuggler - I see you are disparaging towards those who go to state schools - "a public education".

A person's education is more than just "school" - that's why so many "uni-educated" socialist/progressive/eco-fascist types are total idiots (Uncle Joe's useful idiots at that).

One's primary and secondary school education is generally determined by one's parents. I don't recall having any say as to which primary school I went to in Grade 1. Maybe you're different - please tell us.

Tertiary education is not for everyone - I can design things, but I am no good at welding - which is why we employ boilermakers, your house was built by (non-university educated) carpenters etc .... you get the drift?

My parents taught me it is very rude to make fun of other people's spelling mistakes, pronunciations etc. There can be many reasons for it.

My computer's keyboard doesn't always do what my fingers and brain tell it to do. However, that is no reflection on my ability to read, write or comprehend.

I find your post to be rather offensive and seems to be something that some half-smart dick who is full of him/herself and thinks winning an argument is done by belittling your opponent.

I would suggest you come back with concise logical arguments, using facts. Maybe I am asking a little too much of you - please surprise me.

Oh - and yes - where exactly did YOU go to school budgie smuggler???

[kraka]

11.

Perhaps-but he should still stand aside found so. That is the majority view of the electorate and the MSM. But then again you haven't been in the majority since the global warming scam collapsed.

[budgie smuggler]

12.

With respect Mr T, I responded with that post when the philosopher posted this-
' Dear canary Penis perhis he is..No one has said that he isn't. I take it your poor comprehension and reading abaility results from a public education."
If you look back at any of my posts, you'll find that I'm very restrained-
unlike many on this site.
Are you going to ask the philosopher to try being civilised now?

[John Mc]

13.

Perhaps......he's innocent.

Perhaps......he's not! Perhaps he's a revolting slime ball that Australians will find completely repulsive when they know the truth. Just not repulsive enough for Gillard to not sell her soul to keep power.

[Mr T]

14.

ThePhilosopher - it would be best to be a little civilised/polite in our posts.

The socialist/progressive/eco-fascists are firing blanks - for all their fancy theory, the reality shoots them down in flames.

Regardless of their "using their tongues prettier than a $2 whore", they have no facts or reality to back their bleatings, and bleatings they truly are.

So, please, refrain from their ugliness, be nice - and beat them by using facts and logic.
Remember what it is that we think we are that makes us better than the socialist/progressive/eco-fascists. They hate humanity - we love humanity.

[budgie smuggler]

15.

" They hate humanity - we love humanity."
Would you call yourself a secular humanist Mr T ?

[Mr T]

16.

I am what I am. I belong to no "-ism", I subscribe to no "religion".

Tell me, budgie smuggler, - do you hate humanity?

Are you one who believes humans must be controlled by their self-appointed masters?

Are you one who believes humans must be purged from this planet - to "save" it?

Tell me, budgie smuggler, what it is that drives you - idealism or ?????

[Joseph]

17.

A post that asks a question and has no opinion and is unsigned.

FAIL.

[John Mc]

18.

You've really got nothin', haven't you.

[Mr T]

19.

Joseph - to whom are you addressing your comment?

I can't speak for anyone else, but I am not a mind-reader.

[Joseph]

20.

You've really got nothin', have/ you.

FTFY.

[Mr T]

21.

Joseph - if you have trouble copying peoples' names, you can use the "Reply" button.

Then posters/readers other than yourself will know to whom you refer.

thanks

[John Mc]

22.

I'll take that as "you're right, I've got nothing to say". All those posts and no content of value. FAIL.

[John Mc]

23.

This is to turn doughboy's bold off.

[Aussieute]

24.

It would appear following reading Chapter 1 Section 3 of the constitution that The Speaker cannot stand down, and so must resign. The Speaker can remain the Speaker and not be present, but cannot be present and be the Speaker

I may have this wrong but as the highest officeholder in the Parliament it would appear that such would be prudent to retain credibility of the Parliament

[John Angelico]

25.

Ahem, error in the heading - he hasn't resigned. He has stepped aside, which is not quite the same.

[Andy Semple]

26.

just an observaton, kraka.
if wilkie has got any ticker, he'd stick it to gillard.

pity windsor and oakeshott are both gutless

[Grantley]

27.

OK....let us allow the inquiry to complete its course...I would suggest by this Friday (April 27. 2012) at 3 pm should be enough time to establish the facts (& I am being generous).

Afterall the allegations are very serious against the highest office in our parliamentary system, an office that is supposedly beyond reproach....so I would expect it a small ask for everyone concerned to extract their collective digit and get to the bottom of this...so lets have the facts by 3pm friday.

Then lets decide what happens....but if anything in these allegations is found to be true then is it not time that this entire farce that was once known as our Federal Parliament is wound up forthwith, all future candidates placed on notice that high expectations of personal behaviour are demanded and an election called at the earliest posible time.

If the allegations are proved to be false then we go on.

But I will re-iterate.....I for one am totally fed up with politicians from all sides who strut around as though they have some sort of superior right to be where they are.....you (MP's) are OUR elected representatives and its high time you started representing !!

(getting off soap box....kicking the crap out of soap box.....walking away limping....stubbed me !!#@#@! toe)

[kraka]

28.

You I think of this government and the words lying, deceitful,incompetent,brainless,slimy,stupi,gutless,cover-up,stench,corruption. And then I think of the names of those who not only support them (as is their right)but DEFEND them (the indefensible). Thats when I start thinking-SIGNEDIN,TEE,DANTE,OLDMAN,TIM,BUDGIESMUGGLER-though its hard to know how many of those names are double ups-seriously is thier that many idiots around. You know you are an idiot defending this grubbly coalition of vested interests when even Michelle Grattan knows how hopeless they are

[ThePhilosopher]

29.

Hey Canary Penis by adopting the nom de plume budgie smuggler you invite nick names like I have given you.

Basicaly you can go and shove a dead seagull down your jocks. Might give you a better appearance than the budgie or the canary

[ThePhilosopher]

30.

Given the previous interactions that I have had with these clowns I have come to the conclusion that they dont understand reason or logic so discussion is a waste of time. They only have one project and that is to cause disruption so I treat them accordingly.

[ThePhilosopher]

31.

Its instructive to note that SIGNEDIN used to go by the name of Charlie Marx and was suspended from this site under that name as well as under signed in.

[ThePhilosopher]

32.

Ask me yourself after you put another dead bird down your jocks.

The answer is blog somewhere else you are not wanted here and this site is quite specific on the front page as to who is welcome. You are not so expect to be treated accordingly bird fetishist

[ThePhilosopher]

33.

Dear Bird penis, I am tertiary educated but sometimes I just leave it unedited when I post. I love the way that birdbrains like you climb all over the spelling rather than deal with the arguement.

[The Judge]

34.

Hope this is sorted out soon before the above Comments and replies are transferred to some girls group on Facebook or Twitter. I thought this business was a bit more serious

[Richo]

35.

Q. What's Peter Slipper's favourite form of contraception?

A. The withdrawal method.

[Account Deleted]

36.

Tone it down, ThePhilosopher

"Hey Canary Penis by adopting the nom de plume budgie smuggler you invite nick names like I have given you."

Andy Semple
Menzies House

[Craig Buchanan]

37.

Isn't it ironic? Julia backs a rebel who is willing to stab his own parliamentary colleagues in the back for personal gain, and then a few months down the track it turns out that he may also be willing to fiddle his expenses for personal gain, and to badger members of his staff for personal gain. Does anyone see a trend here? Perhaps the Prime Minister and her colleagues should remember that if it looks too good to be true then it probably is.

[cbn]

38.

Thanks Judge, totally agree. Freedom of speech and opinion, yes. However, those who speak up in the Menzies House forum should keep to the subject and those who don't wish to should find themselves some other meeting place.

[jules]

39.

New take on old jingle! Can any other country boast such a broad minded PM?

http://youtu.be/PG73ri09vj4

[Grumpyoldman2]

40.

I sent this to my local Federal MP:

Re Today’s news, I have a suggested question for one of you to ask the PM in the House.

“In the light of a parallel case, if it is proved prima facie that Speaker Slipper harassed a member of the public using his work telephone, and gave Cab Charge dockets to friends, will the investigation also be referred to Fair Work Australia, to give that body the opportunity to demonstrate it has learned how to investigate and prepare the proper brief to the next level.”

It is a bit sad to see all the point scoring nonsense tangled up in this remarkable issue. I suppose free speech means just thatto some, but free doesn't mean valueless.

[John Mc]

41.

Another attempt at getting rid of bold.

[ibbit]

42.

"Perhaps...he's innocen"? Perhaps, perhaps, perhaps!

He's a slime bag and why he was allowed to continue as representative of his electorate is a mystery which only the LNP can answer.

However, continue he did, and to a certain extent this reflects on the Liberal Party. However, knowing about his maladroit and odourous behaviour - and the PM must have known as it seems everyone in Canberra, as opposed maybe to his electorate - knew this, Gillard is deeply enfolded by his odour.

How can a person of so poor judgement of character, to be kind, have risen to become PM of our country?

No need to elaborate on that rhetorical question.

Obviously the PM did not learn much morality inside or outside school and how this shows. This applies - whether fair or not - to her colleagues, too.

They have bought her, so they have also bought the aroma clinging to her. No good pointing to Slipper or Thompson and saying it is all down to them.

It is the PM who protects them by hiding behind legalise which is bereft of integrity and any and all dignity.

As for Craig Emerson who, this morning, said Mr. Abbott was trying to use the mess for political advantage. What a joke. Our morning radio presenter pointed out what a nonsense this was by saying it was the PM who landed herself in this mess by luring a person of magnificent odour to the Speakership for her political advantage.

Emmerson is a fool if he thinks the electorate will buy this.

The best things now would be an election in order to enable the electorate to pronounce on the merits or otherwise of this stinking government.

[ibbit]

43.

Secular humanist? Who gives a fig?

What the average Australian, irregardeless of their philosophical leaning, expects from the government is decency, consistency, good policy - for all, integrity, honesty and above all after the Slipper Affair, to call an election.

This way they would have no alternative other than to listen to the voice of the electorate which they currently ignore, and denigrate with labels such as "convoy of incontinence", among other things.

[kraka]

44.

Here is Crikey's informed opinion re the appointemnt of slipper

"The opposition appears to have again been outsmarted by Labor over the speakership as it was in September last year…….

Labor’s end-of-year momentum just picked up considerable speed. It’s a huge turnaround from just a few weeks ago when the government appeared in terminal trouble."

Is it any wonder the left is in the minority-how stupid would a country be where the left leaning view is the majority-Greece anyone? Europe?

[Brian]

45.

It's a pity to see a Menzies House "comments forum" deteriorate into such low grade exchanges of views, I would have expected better. It goes without saying that this government and its appendages are all of the lowest form, it is Labor afterall and not as though it's ever been any different. Governments decay from the top down, merely look at our past and around the world and you will see what I mean. When you install a low-life like Gillard, you need then only look at the motley list of appendages that have aided her in this saga, to wit: Windsor, Oakeshott, Wilkie and Slipper. You can look as hard as you like, but you will never find four greater self-serving vile opportunists than these sleazebags, not even Whitlam had this much baggage, and that's saying something.

As if having the putrid Thomson remaing on Labor's backbench isn't enough (of course he says he's "innocen"t, what else is this weasel going to say?), we've now got the Speaker of the House under scrutiny for all manner of things (and once again, the cry of, this time - "I deny all allegations"), all on the taxpayer dollar. Labor doesn't have one member in its parliamentary caucus with enough moral courage or guts to say - "enough is enough!"

God help Australia, and shame on this tawdry bunch of swill that continues to try and call themselves a government, that they should tarnish the memory of our ANZAC's during this week of 25 April, with such a spread of unacceptable headlines.

[ThePhilosopher]

46.

Interesting Kraka that thismornings lates poll release shows the ALP and Greens set to be wiped out in the Senate in a landslide. This of course leaves the reps as unwinable for them.

Roll on polling day and an end to this swill

[ThePhilosopher]

47.

Is telling him to stuff a seagle down his jocks legal then ?

I can refer to him as seagull smuggler instead of Budgie Brains

[ThePhilosopher]

48.

Thats an old tactic by the " Shut down Menzies House Group " Andy and I have been transfer posted before.

The Judge....sounds like a cartoon character to me but you are probably just a sock puppet.

I play hard ball judge so dont get in the way sludge judge

[ThePhilosopher]

49.

Yes cbn I have to agree perhaps you will actualy post something on the subject soon. I know that I have sockpuppet....here we go lets kick up a fuss and see if we can get him thrown off....go for it troll

[Account Deleted]

50.

Just try and be a little civil

[kraka]

51.

I agree with Andy Phil-getting a bit ranty now-best to ignore the trolls.

[kraka]

52.

Besides, since the retirement of Brown and the Qld election the frequency of the troll visits has seriously declined. Only a small percentage (say around 29%)of the rusted on are still trying to enforce the socialist utopia.

[Mr T]

53.

"Given the previous interactions that I have had with these clowns...."

I know that, Philosopher - but they're only children and should be treated accordingly - even if they do make you angry.
Children do this on purpose occasionally - just to make you angry, no other reason.

As you say: "They only have one project and that is to cause disruption so I treat them accordingly." Which is what they want you to do.

When you look at a name like "budgie smuggler" - it's meant to be rude and upset decent people. I look at a name like that and come to the conclusion, obviously, that the owner must be a real dick.

Like I said - they are only children, and should be treated as such.

[Mr T]

54.

Andy - you are right if for no other reason that, if it comes to a contest of vulgarity and rudeness, the left/socialist/progressive/eco-fascists will beat us hands down.

It's a bit like mud wrestling with a pig - you can't win and the pig loves it.

They will get sick of civility long before we do.

[Burt]

55.

Mt sounds like it's been a long time between comes

[Mr T]

56.

Sorry Burt - I don't follow you......

[Tom Skene]

57.

Actually your headline is quite wrong...he has stood down not resigned....as so often happens on this site statements are just plain wrong,,,try harder!

[Joseph]

58.

The devil is in the detail something that eludes lazy bloggers.

[kraka]

59.

troll alert-press ignore.

[ThePhilosopher]

60.

I stand by it. Its his coice of nom de plume

[ThePhilosopher]

61.

Extremely preachy especialy from youKraka.

I will have my fun with the children as it suits me.

[ThePhilosopher]

62.

Mr T hardly rudeness...wheree have you been. Not on the streets.

I have little time for ivory tower elitists of any persuasion.

The real fight is not just in here and it is physical as well as intellectual.

[ThePhilosopher]

63.

Dream on Kraka Dream on. You will wake up with a red in your bed.

If you believe that your head is somewhere that it shouldn't be. Andy would send me another picture of himself pointing if I said where

[Zaphod]

64.

So, the reds are currently UNDER the bed Philosopher?
hmmm. deja vu here.

[Zaphod]

65.

I know this will sound pedantic, but hasn't Slipper stood down, and not actually resigned?

[captain catholic]

66.

Interesting to note that he hasn't stood down from his priestly duties in the anglican church. (a church founded on the family values of Henry the eighth)

[bluebell]

67.

Slipper has just been asked to stand aside by his church leader until his ever growing list of charges have been dealt with. I guess he can return subject to total acquittal of all said charges :-) besides, he can kiss his Speakership roll tut ta.....and probably his marriage as well. Can't say I feel sorry for the guy. He bought it all upon himself...and Labor knew exactly what they where getting in this guy also. Abbott tried to warn the red headed goose that the guy was bad news, and that if she took him he would become HER man...and therefore HER headache!

[Mr T]

68.

captain catholic - i had a good laugh when i read "a church founded on the family values of Henry the eighth".

It's the history of the world, isn't it.

[Mr T]

69.

You can believe me when I say I have not had a sheltered life.

As far as the ivory tower elitists go, these mongrels use the system for all it's worth to their own advantage, and then condemn it vehemently. That's why they're usually the first up against the wall when the revolution starts.

I am under no illusion that anything you or I say/write here, or anywhere else, will change the minds of the left/socialist/eco-fascist/progressive/communists - they know they are correct and that we should all be removed from the body of the state, like the cancer we are.

Trouble is, the physical fight you refer to will not come from these scum as they will use the power of the state to do it for them. I would love a stand-up fight with them, but they are too cowardly for that to happen.

They indoctrinate our children in primary school and .... you know the story.

I use my spare time trying to make as many people as possible aware of the insidious nature of our foe.

In the meantime, it's fun being here beating them in an intellectual fight. I know my limitations - but we're arguing here with children who know they have all knowledge - it's no fun abusing them because that's what they like. Perhaps they were abused growing up - and liked it? I don't know. It's not much of an intellectual fight either (bit like the old saying - they bring a knife to a gunfight).

[bluebell]

70.

Captain Catholic does have a way with words - especially when it comes to tearing Christianity to shreds....shame he doesn't use the same energy & passion to that wonderful religion of peace...Islam.

[captain catholic]

71.

Do I detect a note of sarcasm bluebell?
Islam, Christianity and Judaism all require the sleep of reason.
I'm surprised any here want to defend any of them. I thought menzies house followers were into personal responsibility.
The idea of vicarious redeption should be an anathema.

[bluebell]

72.

I have no problem with you putting religion under the microscope - however, it seems that you single Christianity for special attention, especially the Catholic religion....and while Christianity is far from perfect, it is streets ahead of that serial human rights offender, Islam.

[Mr T]

73.

bluebell - I agree with you - but you gotta laugh at "the anglican church (a church founded on the family values of Henry the eighth)"

Now that is genuinely funny.(And true).

[Mr T]

74.

And bluebell - Christianity has been around for 2000 years - and it's had much more formidable foes than captain catholic - and survived.

[bluebell]

75.

Ok - I will grudgingly pay Captain Catholic a compliment for his rapier wit....and I have to be honest, I did have a 'right royal' laugh. The C of E is falling apart anyway. Alas, distancing themselves from old Slippery won't halt the decline.

[captain catholic]

76.

" Christianity has been around for 2000 years"
Mr T , you and I both know that that is not because of the veracity of religion's claims about reality. It's because there's a never ending supply of credulity.

[captain catholic]

77.

" it seems that you single Christianity for special attention, especially the Catholic religion..."
As an aside bluebell, did you happen to catch cardinal pell (without god you are nothing) say that jews were intellectually and morally inferior on q@a ?

[bluebell]

78.

Ok - for the record I am Presbyterian. But I do have a brother in law that is a seriously practicing tyke (opps, I meant Catholic) My sister is still Presbyterian.

Did Pell actually say that? Geez!
Sounds like something that Iranian Prez Mahmoud Ahmadinejad would come out with, not a high ranking Catholic priest! Methinks the good Cardinal should take a good look at Catholic morality when 25% of the Nazi SS where good upstanding Catholic boys...and Pope Pius, who stood by knowing what the Nazi's were doing to Europe's Jewry. From the Spanish Inquisition, to the Holocaust, to the global sex abuse scandals, and forced adoptions in Catholic Ireland, these hierarchical cretins have a gall to call Jews intellectually and morally inferior!

[Mr T]

79.

I think it may be a bit more than that - I think it may be a part (or a fault) of human nature that needs something to be believed in, whether religion, a leader (Hitler), an organisation (WWF) etc.

Think about how many people you have known over the years who have not needed anything to believe in - no need to be part of an organisation or belief/religion? For most people, this belief/religion controls or modifies their behaviour in a positive way (with one major exception).

I am referring to people who have genuinely not needed this belief, as opposed to those sad souls who actually believe in nothing (not even themselves). Though I must add that, over the years, I have found there to be a lot more to the universe than the obvious.

But you have to remember that a lot of people need religion - for that reason alone I do not mock their beliefs (apart from the 'religion' that we dare not say its name).

[ThePhilosopher]

80.

Zaphod your fantasy not mine but I am sure you dream longingly of a red headed Juliar under yours.

Basicaly your post makes no sense as it alludes to a projection on your part that is non existant in reality.

[ThePhilosopher]

81.

You and CC are both having trouble with understanding religion so lets start with a primer on the Philosophy of religion.

The existence of God is not something that can be proved or disproved.

In either case we take it as an article of faith that God exists or does not exist. No one can clearly point to a fact that proves absolutely either proposition so it becomes something that one has to accept or reject on the basis of less than certain eveidence which is what faith amounts too.

Now the application of reason to this question can only take you so far. Faith is as much part of atheism as it is of theism

CC has obviously a religious problem that has unbalanced his sense of reason and tipped him from reason and objectivity into the camp od rabid atheism.

[ThePhilosopher]

82.

CC stop ruining threads with irrelevant comment. See my discussion on faith as an essential component of atheism and theism.

[ThePhilosopher]

83.

Do morals as such have an objective existence ? Are thjey social constructs and thus subject to modification ? Can we just do what we want then ?

[ThePhilosopher]

84.

CC rants dogmaticaly in usual rabid way ....I'm surprised any here want to defend any of them. I thought menzies house followers were into personal responsibility.
The idea of vicarious redeption should be an anathema.....

Poor use of theology and demonstrates your lack of insite. You dont understand predestination nor do you have any idea of what you describe as vicarious redemption.

Personal responsibility is at the heart of the doctrine. The whole issue is that we will be personaly responsible for all our actions. Who or what taught you theology ? The whole of your brain is stewed.

Can you find a religious site to troll...I tire of your ill informed an uneducated attempts at philosophy and theology.

You dont have a clue and should not try to rant about what you do not understand.

[ThePhilosopher]

85.

A church founded on the family values of Henry VIII

A common jibe and lacking in historical insite and understanding of the reformation and in particular as to how it unfolded in the British Isles. The reform movement well pre dates Henry

[Mr T]

86.

ThePhilosopher - you have absolutely no knowledge of what I understand about religion - absolutely none at all.

Do not presume to lecture me on what is or isn't, may or may not be.

How about you tell me what God is? After all, you state that God's existence is a matter of faith. Faith in what exactly?

[Mr T]

87.

"The reform movement well pre dates Henry" - whatever.

Tell me then, who exactly founded the Church of England??? And we're not talking about the church in England, founded by St Augustine.

[Mr T]

88.

"Do morals as such have an objective existence ? Are thjey social constructs and thus subject to modification ? Can we just do what we want then ?"

OK - are you saying that only religious people can treat others morally? That a person without faith in some "God created in the image of Man" (did I get that round the right way?) can only be and do evil?

Could you expand on what you are trying to say - in case I misinterpreted the above?

[Cat]

89.

Evidently Pell forgot his lord and saviour was born a Jew :(

[captain catholic]

90.

" CC stop ruining threads with irrelevant comment."
Philosopher, (of what exactly?) I find it amusing that you accuse me of irrelevant comment, and then run off on the tangent with gusto.
Am I wrong in assuming that you're a fence sitter (ie. agnostic)
Oh yeah. If you're going to try the pseudo-intellectual angle, perhaps you should use spell check more often. Cheers.

[captain catholic]

91.

He's apologised for putting his pope washed foot in his mouth.